CallyT welding seams. pros/cons.

[Stupink]

Done a bit of a search on here, but keep finding pesky nova info..

Anyone got any experience/info on weldign up the seams on a CallyT.

The engine is currently out my car, the bonnet/bumpers/doors/boot/wings/interior (not dash) are currently all stripped.

Going to be a ~350+ type engine going back in hopefully, has lowered/stiffened suspension, will be adding polly bushes all round and strut braces front/rear.

Wondering if while the engine is out, I ought to weld the seams? is it worth it on these cars? what seams need doing really? would i need to remove the rack/accumulator/gearbox/txb/servo etc etc.. could the dash stay in ? or do you need to weld from that side too?

General guides/experience/ideas wanted.. I have and can use Mig, and have pit in garage if benificial. Shell to be resprayed/waxoyled/stoneguarded soon, so not bothered about paintwork etc.

[cavydave]

dont really need it.novas lack a subframe so are flimsy.just put a strut brace on

[welshwizzard]

seam welding strengthens and stiffens the shell. All rally/race cars are seam welded, It all depends on how you intend on using the finished car.

[SimonT]

Can't hurt. I'm sure you've noticed the dash creaking slightly when you chuck the car around a bit (mine did anyway) and the large glasses area doesn't help with shell rigidity either.

Personally i wouldn't go for full seam welding, probably just get it stitched and some proper mounts for the brace welded in.

[cavydave]

seam welding strengthens and stiffens the shell. All rally/race cars are seam welded, It all depends on how you intend on using the finished car.

this is due to removing subframes for fast repair and weight saving.vaux designed the shell to accomadate a heavy and powerfull engine.not a petrol sawing machine like the nova.hense strengthening kits

[Stupink]

Well its going to be a phase4 track/weekend car.
I want to do everything possible that i can think of to improve handeling/feedback from the car.

I wasn't going to full seam weld it, just one in three inches or something to "help". i've noticed flex in the car! mainly around the bulkhead, but dont currently have a strutt brace, thats going in shortly.

My mate who used to do rallying who I was yapping to today was very enthusiastic about it, but he did full seam welding..

Anymore thoughts with this info??

If/when i do it, I presume its best to get it jacked up and release the stress on the suspension etc first?

[Rob_S]

for mainly road use i would just look at a full cage and turret top welding front and back. assuming rest of car is in good nick of course.

[Stupink]

Do you mean interior roll cage? I want to maintain "standard" looks, so unfortunately a cage is not really feasible..

by turret top welding do you mean just seam weld around the turrets? or do you mean something else? plating or something? I'm not too clued up with the tech terms

the car is in average condition, but it is a 92, so I think it might appreceate some help heheh.

[Rob_S]

forget the rest then, a cage is what stiffens the shell. now if you weld the shell up without support it will crack
i wouldnt take it near a track without a cage either, they handle like a barge

[Stupink]

yeah i've been on track with it a few times, not exactly wonderfull, but still good fun. Cage could be something in the future, but for now the car is also planned as my personal daily driver, will have any-use work car, so daily means once or twice a week heheh.

Why would it crack without a cage? surely its going to make it stronger. if the origional spot welds dont crack under the flex why would the additional weld crack under even less flex? If i were rallying it then I could appreceate that, but would that really be true under road and the odd trackday use?

[Rob_S]

a seam weld without support will flex (obviously, no cage to brace the shell) and when it flexes it can break
spot welds dont crack because the panels flex (having said that some do break, but theres a gap so its only 1 that breaks)

given no cage, i would stich weld the turret tops (and put a panel under if necessary) that then leaves you with a stronger support for the suspension yet allowing flex in the joins more
(having said all that i never seam weld, its the whole car stiched for me)

[Stupink]

Hi, as I initially said in one of my posts above, I never intended to fully seam weld the car, just one inch every 3/4 inches or so to help support the car further than the origional spots.

Did you realise thats what i meant, and are your comments still valid? or did you mis understand me and would this be acceptable? what sort of frequency would be good, one inch ever 3-4 depending on seam lengh? or would more/less be better?

cheers for the advice

[Rob_S]

comments still valid, thought your mate was saying to seam weld!
you need to do this on a bare shell, all cleaned up then repaint. you dont just bang a few welds in...apart from the fact that as soon as you penetrate the weld you will set fire to the car lol

[Nemesis]

Stupink you have 4WD so handling is already sorted. If however the shell is flexing then strut braces really do make a difference. As for seam welding you could just weld the key areas ie where the bulkhead meets the turrets etc...

[ChrisReay]

I would say they do need strengthening around the A pillar/chassis leg area and around the suspension top mountings.


Where front wing bolts on


Inner wing to suspension top


Standard strengthening to A pillar starting to pull away

Underside of suspension top mounting

[Stupink]

Cheers for all the thoughts Rob.
So if I were to do it, and the odd one did break as you were suggesting, surely I would still be better off than before? or could this cause more harm than simply breaking and going back to the std spot welds??

My car looks like those pictures Chris has posted, this is what has started me off thinking, it just doesn't look strong enough anymore and its certainly not a solid structure imo.

Chavtastic.. 4x4, handeling sorted?? It may go round corners faster than 2wd, but it's just as much a fat heavy pig with 0 feedback. the 4x4 system helps, but you still have to take all the usual steps to tighten up the handling.

That's my car a while back, I've stripped it a bit more already, and it's getting a respray, so the actual welding i'm not fussed about, won't be too much bother and I'll have an extinguisher at the standby.. been there done that lol. mmm waxoyl.. lol lmao


Chris, or anyone.. Any thoughts on how to go about these sorts of areas? theres not room to do 1in3inches or whatever, would be best to keep it broken i'd think, but what would be best. every other cm or something or just add another inch run where possible?

[Rob_S]

yeah, i put above stich welding the whole car is best with reference to your mate seam welding the lot
thats for rallying tho, here you still have flex in the panels, so go lightly and do the main points that are needed...cant tell you what needs done, but from what you have said the bulkhead and turrets would be a good start

[Miles]

Whilst on this subject I discovered this crack on mine the other day. There was a hole near this position, but above the seam on the other side when I bought the car that I, erm, expertly welded a plate over



Any gen on how to deal with this crack?

Your welcome to borrow my welder if you need to Stu, if its up to your standards That clutch arm is still going strong on mothers car!

Also just seen steel front strut braces for £58.50 on proven products website for the Calibra turbo, are they likely to make much difference?

[cavgsi]

I'd just run a weld over the crack if it's only whats shown in the pic, keep an eye on it and plate it later if it comes back (although it shouldnt!)

[Stupink]

WOW the arm held all this time.. must be doing something right heheh.
I have a little mig here anyway but cheers for the offer

I can't really see from the picture where the crack starts/ends etc.. have you removed the plastic arch liner and examined that side? (or can you see there anyway? i think you might be able to without removing it) I'd be interested to see some better pictures (and/or pop over if your about!) before suggesting what to do.. if its cracking because its weakened from rust then it wants plating.. if its not because its rusty then i'd be wanting to know why its cracked..
Mines actually plated there as well, but a bit further down.. the whole turret is sound as a bell, but a 2pence piece sized rust hole was on it when i bought it, quite why/how it rusted out so severely in such a localised spot i'll never know.

[Miles]

Thanks for the input. Not inspected further. I'll try and have a look from the other side and get some pics if there is anything to show. Yeah, if you could have a look at it sometime it would be ideal, sort something out sometime


It passed an mot like it is last week.

[Stupink]

LOL remind me to get the number of that MOT station in case i ever need it heheh..

would definately reccomend inspecting sooner rather than later, very hard to tell from pics, but that blob on the left looks like it could potentially hole with a toffee hammer? maybe its just the photo, would suggest evils hiding the other side.. does it sound solid or muffled if you thwack it?

[Miles]

Its the £20 place down from German, Swedish and French in the Red light district!

Investigated further.....OMG!

[Stupink]

Doh.. man thats not good...
talk about dodgy mot's lol.. I don't even know anyoen i could pay to get that thru lol let alone under a normal mot lol..

If you want a hand to sort it out let me know. I'm far too pished atm to make any sense, just got back from a mates wedding, so i'll shutup before i start whittering lol
needless to say.. welding not an option, plating needed!!!!!

[Miles]

In fairness to the mot guy you wouldn't have noticed it from underneth until I poked the hole through and pealed the underseal off.

Thanks for the offer mate, although by offering a hand I hope you understand your offering to do it all, due to your superior welding skills lmao

It could do with sorting quickly, and I wont be able to put any time into it until I finish my exams and get back from holiday, which about a months time, and it could do with being sorted by then, so I might ask this local bloke I know if he'll do it cheaply.