House prices, economy, outlook 2008

[-Sye]

Originally Posted by SRimon

The doom and gloomers annoy me, just because some of us work hard for our houses, bust a gut, why should we suffer for people wanting/praying for prices to come down. Then basically waiting for the easy ride.

This isn’t a personal dig at you but just like the so called doom mongers are annoying you now the smug property “owners” with their 100% mortgages have annoyed me constantly in the past rambling on about how their property has increased in value by 24767457% in the last 30seconds.

I’d imagine everyone that doesn’t own a property or didn’t buy in the boom feels exactly like you in relation to working hard and busting a gut to pay tax to prop up the property market. Why should the tax payer pay for an easy ride for the banks and the sheep that can’t see further than the end of their nose.

Originally Posted by Jack

We need someone assertive with their head screwed on right to come and say "what does this department do? Why are we paying for this? Why is this camera here? What is the WHGMSA department in Bristol doing? Where is all of our money going?"

In theory that maybe a good idea if there were other jobs that the thousands of civil slackers could go to but there isn’t, so if the government do lay them off then unemployment figures would rocket making the government look bad.

[lethal]

I wasn't trying to bash you Andy, just the notion that the govt. is in some way not majorly responsible for the deepness of the s**t we find ourselves in. I don't think this incompetent government deserves to be cut any slack over the handling of the economy. Credit where credit is due and all that.

Looking forward, in PMQs today, Crash Gordon laid out his plans for all those empty BTL flats in the cities. He plans to buy them up with taxpayer's money and turn them into Local Authority housing. Yay for ghettos! Hey, Gordon, the 1960s called and they want their stupid idea back.

There is a snag of course (other than the taxpayer funding it) and that is the Barrat hutches built for the BTL/Inside Track* mob aren't up to the minimum build-quality standards for LA housing. They'd have to change the law and downgrade the requirement before the flats could go on LA books

*Did you know Inside Track seminars went bust a couple of weeks ago?

[Bottlethroddy]

Originally Posted by lethal

Hey, Gordon, the 1960s called and they want their stupid idea back.

I just weed a little bit

[Brett]

Originally Posted by SRimon

The doom and gloomers annoy me, just because some of us work hard for our houses, bust a gut, why should we suffer for people wanting/praying for prices to come down. Then basically waiting for the easy ride.

not having a go, just saying from the other perspective....

I want a house price crash, the other side of the coin to what you say there. As i see it, why should I not benefit from the fact I rightly didnt trust the housing market and chose to stay out? Its not my fault if you didnt realise that it wasnt always going to be stable and were'ntr fully aware of the risk factor. Its not fair if I did the sensible thing and stayed living with my parents to see someone making the mistake I avoided getting bailed out by the govt, what was the point of me hanging on at home for all those years waiting for the inevitable otherwise? Ive put up with hell sometimes at home, just like youve busted a gut to not be there.

It works two ways. I think its absolutley scandelous the govt want to bail you guys out as its just getting you out of jail free, and screwing me for having the foresight to wait.

[j17sparky]

Originally Posted by CraigGreen

That was a piss take, not a fact!

I know

[Jack]

Originally Posted by -Sye

In theory that maybe a good idea if there were other jobs that the thousands of civil slackers could go to but there isn’t, so if the government do lay them off then unemployment figures would rocket making the government look bad.

I'm a "civil slacker", and the sooner someone with cajones steps in here and makes some assertive decisions instead of passing it to the next level of middle-management to be counter-signed with a three different shades of blue ink and entered onto four databases and externally evaluated and audited, then the better off we'll ****ing be.

That day can't come soon enough, IMO.

[Jack]

Originally Posted by Brett

I think its absolutley scandelous the govt want to bail you guys out as its just getting you out of jail free, and screwing me for having the foresight to wait.

Just as the benefit system makes ordinary working people feel like mugs, while people I know get handout money for doing literally **** all.

[j17sparky]

Originally Posted by Jack

I'm a "civil slacker", and the sooner someone with cajones steps in here and makes some assertive decisions instead of passing it to the next level of middle-management to be counter-signed with a three different shades of blue ink and entered onto four databases and externally evaluated and audited, then the better off we'll ****ing be.

That day can't come soon enough, IMO.

Here here!

Unless you are in the public sector i guess its hard to imagine where all the money goes. Well it dont go on our wages thats for fecking sure! Most of it is spent on consultants and middle men, and "Professional Meeting Men" as my boss put it - fecking having to deal with one atm and cant get hold of him because hes a workshy asshole who likes to spend his entire week in meetings.

[lethal]

I was in the public sector once.

I left in disgust at the waste (This was several years ago too!)

[KillBill]

Sounds so familiar. I got asked this week to setup a meeting with an outside consultancy company to help make a decision on some very basic operational issues that we should be deciding in our sleep.
My response was "Why? What for? Why do we need them to tell us the answer to this when all they are going to do is evaluate information given by us and present it to management, and relieve us of about 10 ****ing grand in the process, I don't ****ing think so."
Now I've been trying to get this sorted out among ourselves today, but I'm off on Friday and Monday and you can bet your bottom dollar the person who wanted said meeting in the first place will organise it behind my back when I'm not here, even though they're not yet sure why they even need to make this decision, or if the outcome will actually be of any use.

As sparky says, when you work in a government agency you can easily see where all the money gets pissed away. Its truly staggering, I do what I can and try to prevent needless waste at any opportunity (such as this one), but you can only do so much when the overflowing middle management top-down culture leans towards using insultants for the most trivial of tasks, and takes responsibility for nothing. I'm a manager myself and try and pass down the idea of - actually doing the work or making a decision yourself - but when the top brass are all essentially the antithesis of that then there's **** all you can do in the grand scheme of things. I try not to think about it.

[Jack]

Originally Posted by KillBill

As sparky says, when you work in a government agency you can easily see where all the money gets pissed away.

Sad, but very true.

http://jobs.tes.co.uk/job.aspx?jobId=501284

Check this job advertisement out and then say you wonder where all the money goes.

[lethal]

You may be from within or around the education sector; equally you may come from a different world.

Is that the world where they think paying a glorified site manger £120,000pa of the taxpayer's money is in any way justified?

I'd suggest that job warrants about £30,000-£35,000pa because it will have few of the pressures involved in the real Company Executive role that it's pay grade is apparently aligned to.

[KillBill]

Yep.

/EDIT: Removed as it could loose me my job and I've calmed down now

[j17sparky]

Originally Posted by lethal

Is that the world where they think paying a glorified site manger £120,000pa of the taxpayer's money is in any way justified?

Is it just me or can anyone else not figure out what the job actually involves? Ive read it 3 times now and cant for the life of me work out what that £120k is being spent on

Originally Posted by KillBill

/EDIT: Removed as it could loose me my job and I've calmed down now

Done that plenty of times I should really start using usernames in no way connected to me as alot of people know me as or know i am j17sparky

[Brett]

public sector waste can never be sorted out. If a government tried to change it they are all protected by legislation, tape and they'd just go on strike and make it impossible to sort.

[lethal]

Originally Posted by Brett

public sector waste can never be sorted out. If a government tried to change it they are all protected by legislation, tape and they'd just go on strike and make it impossible to sort.

Not impossible, just hard.

The simplest primary method is to dump all the outside consultants and make those in public sector middle management do the jobs instead.

If it turns out that the middle managers are incapable of performing the job they're employed to do....oh....well....that's grounds for dismissal.

[Jack]

Originally Posted by j17sparky

Is it just me or can anyone else not figure out what the job actually involves? Ive read it 3 times now and cant for the life of me work out what that £120k is being spent on

Join the club!

Essentially, a few colleges are merging so we need a principle to manage the merged colleges. That's it.

[lethal]

So they'll be a multi-site manager.

Give em £42,000 and a bus pass then.

[KillBill]

Originally Posted by j17sparky

Done that plenty of times I should really start using usernames in no way connected to me as alot of people know me as or know i am j17sparky

Know what you mean. My usernames nothing to do with my real name, but I'd say a fair few people on here know my name, and it wouldn't be hard to work out who I am based on location, cars, things I've said in posts etc. Just have to remember those high profile cases where people have been shafted over stuff they've said online

[Jack]

I know your name. I even have your email address.

*rings KillBill's boss*

[KillBill]

You wouldn't dare...... don't have me delete your internets....

*Actually, my boss is fecking great, its his boss and his boss' boss we have to worry about

[lethal]

I think that if I worked for a public sector organisation these days, I'd have a permanent account at Wikileaks

[KillBill]

Wikileaks eh....

[lethal]

Originally Posted by KillBill

Wikileaks eh....

Yeah, I just saw a story about them on /.

They appear to be getting sued by Mormons this week

[Rik]

Originally Posted by KillBill

My response was "Why? What for? Why do we need them to tell us the answer to this when all they are going to do is evaluate information given by us and present it to management, and relieve us of about 10 ****ing grand in the process, I don't ****ing think so."

Its because the people at the top don't actually know anything. Thats why they call in these consultants. They are scared of making decisions that will show them up for what they are. So when it goes tits up they just blame the consultants. It won't have anything to do with not being thought out properly in the first place or changed 12 times by the managers or not giving the external companies any relevant information.
They also won't trust staff because they are afraid of them and how much more about the company they actually know. Wouldn't want people under you showing you up now would you .