Vauxhall Owners Forum banner

Is N/A all that great?

2K views 87 replies 24 participants last post by  RDS 
#1 ·
I have been thinking about this now and I honestly can’t find an answer, so I would like some opinions....

Why do people prefer N/A cars to turbo, after seeing many highly tuned N/A cars, it seems that as with turbo's the power is quite high up the rev range, I mean you have to keep up the revs to use the power right, well a good driver in a turbo car would be doing the same thing to eliminate lag

.... So why not just opt for a turbo,
It’s certainly a lot cheaper to get the power from a turbo, also easier to tune:confused:

Remember im only talking about modified N/A engines here
 
#78 ·
tomstickland said:
Well, with reference to the original question, I like NA because it's simple, light, reliable and provides quick response. Turbo is the way for very big power. I'm happy for mid 100s BHP in a light car.
Yep.

You can't beat big power on the motorway, however it is delivered. I loved the Cav Turbo on carriageways and motorways, so good in sixth and really responsive at any speed.

However, I don't live on or particularly near a motorway and on the b-roads and general town driving the civic is better. In the same way that astra GTE owners revel in their low down torque and eager throttle I like hanging around at 7500rpm, before nailing the throttle and changing up at 8500rpm or down at 6000rpm :) The power band in comparison to my standard turbo is world's apart and even makes the XE feel a little restricted, though obviously the red top is faster on the straights.

I've not yet driven an Evo in anger or a subaru.... anywhere, I can bet they are great fun and very addictive, just think I can get my kicks for a lot less bucks at the moment.
 
#79 ·
Tim no disrespect mate but getting into your car would be like going from a GTE 16v in standard form, to a 1.1 metro now!

The throttle response can't be beaten on an N/A , but within 1 second the lack of response has been overtaken by an almightly kick of torque.
I enjoy it when Mike lets me hack around in his Cav GSi cos its a different sort of fun and the feedback is excellent,but you are constantly waiting for that impact of power thats just not there, and without some serious fettling or stripping ya car to make it look like a tin its not gonna appear either:p

Seems like ya well happy with ya Civic though
;)
 
#80 ·
I have no doubts that a fettled GTE, any sort of mildly breathed on vauxhall turbo would give me a kicking, on the straights, and obviously those of you who know how to drive and make use of the 4x4 to it's best advantage will be too much for the little 1.6 but the chassis on the civic, balance of the car and feel of it in general, i.e simple fwd setup make for a very entertaining drive, maybe more so than the Astras. I think what I like most about this car and what I found most frustrating in the cavaliers was the lack of driver involvement, to make any progress in the VTEC you need to be highly involved.

I am slightly amazed at a couple of things though.

1) I didn't fall to the floor proclaiming a love of Vauxhalls at PV2003 and cursing myself for straying.

2) We're getting lots of big power Jap turbos at our place at the moment, yet I am more than content with the schizo granny wagon honda.

Perverse isn't it.
 
#82 ·
But a 'sudden big kick of power' is exactly what you don't want when you are driving a car hard. That makes the car very unpredictable to drive. With a turbo you need to know the lag time, and the exact response of the power delivery in order to apply power coming out of a corner for example.

You need to anitipate, which isn't easy to do. Putting your foot down whilst still turning, then the turbo kicking in, oops, nothing to loads, and I have no control over power delivery.

Whereas normally aspirated allows you to feed power instantly with your foot. You accelerator is more in-time with power delivery which is essential to getting out of a corner quickly.

Mapped boost on a turbo gets around the big boost spike, but the lag still catches you out because while it's not responding to your foot movement, you are pressing the pedal even further towards the floor.

:beer:
 
#83 ·
Its simple:
Neither are best - both have their place and applications that they are well suited to.

Its worth remembering that turbo's are relatively common now cos its a good way for manufacturers to get more power from the same block used in their current vehicle ranges. Previously they would have developed at least a 6 cyl engine - now they tend to just turbo the 1.8/2.0l they already have.

That they do this speaks volumes about the pros and cons of N/A vs Turbos as far as I can see
 
#84 ·
CP@Novaload said:
Its simple:
Neither are best - both have their place and applications that they are well suited to.

Its worth remembering that turbo's are relatively common now cos its a good way for manufacturers to get more power from the same block used in their current vehicle ranges. Previously they would have developed at least a 6 cyl engine - now they tend to just turbo the 1.8/2.0l they already have.

That they do this speaks volumes about the pros and cons of N/A vs Turbos as far as I can see
money and production-wise maybe.

But most serious track cars don't have turbos, they run tuned N/A engines...

For turbos to be effective anti-lag systems are employed, and the turbo life is not so great.

A turbo gives the feel of a large cylinder engine because of it's torque output and thats nice on a motorway for easy cruising, or fast straight line acceleration to say you have a fast car. That doesn't make it better than NA on the track.
 
#85 ·
Thing is Brian Turbo charged F1 cars won many a race, but as pointed out by John A it simply got to dangerous because of the power outputs being achieved! TBH you would think rally cars would employ N/A for control but there all turbo charged too.
 
#86 ·
RDS said:
Thing is Brian Turbo charged F1 cars won many a race, but as pointed out by John A it simply got to dangerous because of the power outputs being achieved! TBH you would think rally cars would employ N/A for control but there all turbo charged too.

...and your going to run their anti-lag systems are a road car that you expect to run for 100,000m? nope.

Done right, turbo will be quicker, no doubt. But the turbo will not last long.

Of course a nitrous anti-lag system might change the stakes so long as everything is mapped right.

Oh, P.S. these V10's are still creating lap records for circuits. i.e. lapped in quicker times than the turbo F1 era..
 
#88 ·
Brian_S said:
Oh, P.S. these V10's are still creating lap records for circuits. i.e. lapped in quicker times than the turbo F1 era..
Thats a silly comparison cos if they were still running turbo F1 cars they would be going a dam sight faster than they did 20 years ago when they were banned;)
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top